Pre mating…..

[SuzAndTheDiva]

I googled raspberry compund for use with fading puppy syndrome, didnt find anything – as in nothing cropped up on the first couple pages……how ‘out’ there is it? I ask because I had never heard of it – or seen it advertised anywhere or even had any breeders i know speak of it……………..I just wonder if its THAT good – shouldnt more be done to promote it? Or maybe im looking for it under the wrong name – whos the lady who makes it does she have a website or how can I contact her? I know people who would definately be interested to know about this ‘just incase’  🙂

[Anonymous]

hi,

KayC – I hope it was OK to quote your article, i did reference you and the original source.

I learned at the weekend that lepto vaccination only shows protection for 3-6mths and as some dogs are unvaccinated (mine included) and many others are only done every 12mths then either – lepto is so rare that you need to balance your +/- as titres can show low/clear and memory cells still be there to protect.  The other thing is that it only protects against 3 from literally thousands of strains.

The dog booster vaccs have been shown to protect for up to 7 years in cases studied.

If you want to vaccinate against parvo there is a choice not to have MLV you can have killed vaccine if you request it.  Could be worth researching ?

I agree it is the most heartbreaking thing to watch a puppy you have loved and cared for die – there will always be “if only” and “what if” I know you will make good choices for Kodi 🙂

re: the raspberry compound – from my personal view, i would say someone who describes themselves as a herbalist would be like a white witch and i thought they channelled positive energy from nature to help them work up tinctures / remedies.  along the same lines while i realise that these people do have something special and that sometimes very sadly ingredients from nature are no longer free and can understand making it into a commercial type product (copyrighting it and charging – how much is for their own morality to say) but what i would class as mis-use of their gift is to not say who or where it is available – surely every breeder / vet in the country needs to be aware of this and they make their informed decision based on their own belief etc ….

i for one, would like details of how to contact the herbalist (perhaps i have missed them?) i know several breeders one of which lost 2 pups recently from a litter in double figures where the rest made it.

Claire.

[Dree]

[quote author=SuzAndTheDiva link=topic=12683.msg245643#msg245643 date=1224268685]
I googled raspberry compund for use with fading puppy syndrome, didnt find anything – as in nothing cropped up on the first couple pages……how ‘out’ there is it? I ask because I had never heard of it – or seen it advertised anywhere or even had any breeders i know speak of it……………..I just wonder if its THAT good – shouldnt more be done to promote it? Or maybe im looking for it under the wrong name – whos the lady who makes it does she have a website or how can I contact her? I know people who would definately be interested to know about this ‘just incase’  🙂
[/quote]

The herbalist who came up with the formula has been ill now for a few years.  She had plans for a website, etc., but has been too ill to do anything about it.  She has always helped people who ask her to, and is always busy.  People have learned about her through word of mouth.  Right now she is too ill to take phone calls, but if you want to phone me, I can get you some.

[Dree]

[quote author=piglet link=topic=12683.msg245662#msg245662 date=1224272150]

re: the raspberry compound – from my personal view, i would say someone who describes themselves as a herbalist would be like a white witch and i thought they channelled positive energy from nature to help them work up tinctures / remedies.  along the same lines while i realise that these people do have something special and that sometimes very sadly ingredients from nature are no longer free and can understand making it into a commercial type product (copyrighting it and charging – how much is for their own morality to say) but what i would class as mis-use of their gift is to not say who or where it is available – surely every breeder / vet in the country needs to be aware of this and they make their informed decision based on their own belief etc ….

i for one, would like details of how to contact the herbalist (perhaps i have missed them?) i know several breeders one of which lost 2 pups recently from a litter in double figures where the rest made it.

Claire.

[/quote]

Claire, as I said, she has been very ill for a few years now.  She has always charged just cost…or has undercharged.  She has never had to look for work, as people are always phoning her re: their sick dogs.  The problem (if that’s the right word) with something like RC is that it is met with scepticism by most….too good to be true, is what most people will think.  (Too good to be true for Bev, even, and she believes in “witchy” stuff.)  The majority of people would rather vaccinate.  (Not you or I, but most.)  Only when people find that orthodox methods aren’t working do they turn to herbalism or homeopathy.

[SuzAndTheDiva]

do you mind pming me her name? I just like to know the background to stuff. I dont need any – not without looking into it more………….

[Anonymous]

dree – yep i think you are right there in that people tend to find alternative medicine when orthodox things fail for them.  

however, i often think their success is actually down to how much faith / belief / trust (whatever you want to call it) that people put in the treatment.  going all “scientific” for a moment – this is the basic psychological principle that yields a placebo effect in people 🙂  it is a powerful effect and i have absolutely no doubt that the strength of effect in alternative meds is directly tied to belief (perhaps i’ll do my diss on it).

e.g. i birthed my son with no medication, no intervention, no hospital etc …. using only warm water birthing pool and hypnosis and felt absolutely no pain.  i didnt have a completely straight forward delivery and had i been in hospital would have pretty much definately had a CS or at the very least a dnc.  yet i had absolutely NO pain and NO baby distress – (yet to meet someone who believes me) but i dont lie !!

how could someone achieve that just with their mind – by totally immersing themselves in the belief it would work 🙂

anyway – back to the point …

i think the mechanism by which most of these therapies work is by belief and who is to say these puppies would have died anyway?  from what you were saying they had survived longer in the first place surely the less quick they deteriorate – the more chance they have of surviving anyway 🙂

claire
(the scientist … sorry)

[GSPmad]

[quote author=piglet link=topic=12683.msg245673#msg245673 date=1224274910]
 going all “scientific” for a moment – this is the basic psychological principle that yields a placebo effect in people 🙂  it is a powerful effect and i have absolutely no doubt that the strength of effect in alternative meds is directly tied to belief (perhaps i’ll do my diss on it).
[/quote]

see i reckon you can get a placebo effect in animals too – again off topic sorry – esp dogs, because they pick up so strongly on our feelings and emotions. if WE believe it, that has a positive benefit for them… and could there not to some extent be mroe relaxed breeder, hence more relaxed bicth, hence less stress hormones going thro milk etc etc…. ?

[Anonymous]

yes indeed – see for once i have had 3 glasses of vinooooo as i finally have rest day tomorrow

harpy biffday everywun ….

be good hic !

[Dree]

[quote author=piglet link=topic=12683.msg245673#msg245673 date=1224274910]
dree – yep i think you are right there in that people tend to find alternative medicine when orthodox things fail for them.  

however, i often think their success is actually down to how much faith / belief / trust (whatever you want to call it) that people put in the treatment.  going all “scientific” for a moment – this is the basic psychological principle that yields a placebo effect in people 🙂  it is a powerful effect and i have absolutely no doubt that the strength of effect in alternative meds is directly tied to belief (perhaps i’ll do my diss on it).

e.g. i birthed my son with no medication, no intervention, no hospital etc …. using only warm water birthing pool and hypnosis and felt absolutely no pain.  i didnt have a completely straight forward delivery and had i been in hospital would have pretty much definately had a CS or at the very least a dnc.  yet i had absolutely NO pain and NO baby distress – (yet to meet someone who believes me) but i dont lie !!

how could someone achieve that just with their mind – by totally immersing themselves in the belief it would work 🙂

anyway – back to the point …

i think the mechanism by which most of these therapies work is by belief and who is to say these puppies would have died anyway?  from what you were saying they had survived longer in the first place surely the less quick they deteriorate – the more chance they have of surviving anyway 🙂

claire
(the scientist … sorry)
[/quote]

Hi Claire,

Interesting hypothesis.  🙂  But dogs (and ill dogs at that) don’t know if they are getting a placebo or the real thing.  You cannot will an ill dog well.  (I wish it were possible.)  The dogs don’t believe in anything…..placebo or herbs or anything. 

The pups survived because they started showing symptoms later, just a day later, than the first pup.  (Not all pups start to show symptoms at exactly the same time.)

An example….with homeopathy, not herbs.  We had a dog ill with a distemper like disease.  (We believe he picked it up from the urine of a vaccinated pup….but that’s not the point.)  To cut a long story short, the vets had given up…..he was in extreme pain, temperature through the roof, pulse so fast you couldn’t count it, etc.  He was dying at our feet.  OH was about to take him to be pts….I phoned the herbalist (of whom I’d just learned) and she said to give him one Thuja 30…..hubby dived out to get it.  Within minutes of being given the Thuja, he stood up, and walked outside to clean himself.  Magic?  Placebo???  You decide.  🙂

[Anonymous]

i’m glad for the pup 🙂

i have used belladonna for mastitis (yes i did feel like a cow when the GP said lol – i was right back to james herriott haha) and i am grateful it saved me from having to have antib’s while feeding.

its not that i dont trust alt. remedies – from my comments you can see i clearly trust ones i’ve chosen to experience – but i am a scientist at heart i am logical at the expense of rationality and my internal discourse will always be at odds with understanding how it works vs acceptance it just does 😉

i have watched a pup die after i had helped rear it for almost 4 weeks and wouldnt wish it, mummified or resorbs on anybody.  the more that are saved from suffering the better – whatever intervention that may be 🙂

claire x

[Dree]

[quote author=piglet link=topic=12683.msg245690#msg245690 date=1224278150]

i have watched a pup die after i had helped rear it for almost 4 weeks and wouldnt wish it, mummified or resorbs on anybody.  the more that are saved from suffering the better – whatever intervention that may be 🙂

claire x
[/quote]

I nursed a pup through a virul infection, and had to have it pts at four months old.  (This is before I knew anything about herbs, although whether they would have helped, who knows.)  I had bred it, watched it being born, watched it play with its litter-mates.  And I held it when it died.  Yes, whatever intervention it takes…..

[GSPmad]

[quote author=Dree link=topic=12683.msg245688#msg245688 date=1224277633]
Interesting hypothesis.  🙂  But dogs (and ill dogs at that) don’t know if they are getting a placebo or the real thing.  You cannot will an ill dog well.  (I wish it were possible.)  The dogs don’t believe in anything…..placebo or herbs or anything. 
[/quote]

so you don’t think that animals pick up on and react to human stress and emotions and that can affect them then?  :-\

[Dree]

[quote author=GSPmad link=topic=12683.msg245698#msg245698 date=1224283104]
so you don’t think that animals pick up on and react to human stress and emotions and that can affect them then?  :-\
[/quote]

Oh, yes, I do.  Definitely.  I can have a really happy dog outside the ring, and if I’m not careful, have a worried one in the ring because I’m stressed.  But I also believe that no matter how much I want a dog to get better, it will take the correct medicine (orthodox or otherwise) to make that dog better.  If I believed that all it takes is a placebo, I wouldn’t spend hours trying to get the right “recipe” for each individual dog that someone asks for help with.  I would just send any old herb.  Am I making sense?  ;D

[GSPmad]

To some extent. But in that case would you not agree… owner anxious about dog… stressed… dog stress of illness and stressed because owner is stressed… stress hormones delay healing\ getting well. Owner gives dog something they believe will help (eg placebo) – they are happier – dog picks up on that – stress reduces – body better able to fight illness. See where I’m going?  🙂 Don’t always need medication for whatever illness to get better – body’s own immune system and defences can sort it (except in my case where everything is duff  ::) ).

[Anonymous]

[quote author=GSPmad link=topic=12683.msg245626#msg245626 date=1224260918]
http://www.noahcompendium.co.uk/Merial_Animal_Health_Ltd/Eurican_DHPPi/-31358.html

Contra-indications and warnings of CHV vacc in link above.
[/quote]

Contra-indications, warnings, etc
For animal treatment only.
Do not vaccinate unhealthy animals.
Do not mix with any other medicinal product except EURICAN L.
Vaccination may occasionally cause hypersensitivity reactions in some animals. In such cases symptomatic treatment should be provided. Slight swelling at the injection site may be observed after vaccination. Such swellings will resolve in most animals in 4 to 5 days. Some animals may also show slight dullness during the first three days post vaccination.
In case of accidental self-injection, seek medical advice immediately and show the package leaflet or label to the physician.

           
EURICAN L, thats an annual booster isnt it?, so are they recommending you give it at the same time?

All this is very interesting if a little over my head at times ::), but I’m glad I asked 😀

[Author]

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